@annah_bananah@xanga - I hardly think she was saying "SMOKERS ONLY SMOKE TO HURT THEIR FAMILIES", she was saying that a lot of people that smoke don't realize that it can hurt the people they love just as much as it hurts them personally, and that smokers need to consider that if they get lung cancer or emphezyma or another degenerative disease, they need to consider if their expensive, health-destroying habit is worth hurting so many people over.

To the author, I agree with you, and bravo to you for sharing such a painful story with us. i'm sorry your family had to go through that.

@annah_bananah@xanga - completely agreed.

@randaness@xanga - In your intro before your reply to me you note, "I don't know why people keep saying that some people who don't smoke get cancer and that some people who do smoke don't get cancer -- it's silly, because it has no relevance"

Did you notice this was on  the"healthkicker" site ? If a article on smoking cites cancer, it is relevant to note the genetic aspect of cancer and that people who do consider said.  Secondly add the following quote from the post itself.

"But for people who KNOW the consequences, but don't care, please think of your family who will bear the brunt down the road, when you can no longer take care of yourself.  Please consider it.  I just want to show you the other side of this coin.  And it's not pleasant. 

Are smokers aware of the long term consequences?  Do you think they're selfish to not think about the long term impact on the family? "

I would disagree with your point about it lacking relevance. It is very relevant in reference to the aforementioned. I also noted you cherry picked a sarcastic reference to anti-smoking Nazis. First, speaking as a former smoker relating how I felt as a smoker is relevant to the conversation as it denotes my reaction as a smoker to a anti-smoker ad.  I am responding to her as a ex-smoker as to how anti-smoking propoganda is viewed.

Again, being on a health issue site your remark to me, ""Use or abuse"... this is absurd. Simply using alcohol is not inherently dangerous, whereas I would argue that there is no responsible cigarette-smoking (if there ever was, the art has certainly been lost)."  Absurd ? I guess you are not aware of the impairment of senses and reactions, especially the fact that said impairment at low levels is often not noticed by the person consuming alcohol places them at danger and risk, and using the same logic, of caring about your family and the potential long term consequences of your action, there is relevance...whether you had pondered it or considered it or not. What is relevant to one group of people may not be relevant to another because of their circumstances, experience ,education and knowledge of a subject matter. Also if someone drinks and does not smoke and they hear anti-alcohol sentiment they react. Very rarely do they say I hadnt consdered that. It is a case in point deal wrapped in sarcasm, but has a relevant application. For the record, I am not anti-alcohol either. There is enough alcohol in my home to get properly drunk if one would be that irresponsible and it is me who goes to the state store and buys it (gasps).My DIL smokes when she comes and visits and never a word is mentioned. We tell her we love her and mean it. She knows smoking doesnt improve her health.....

So while I understand it may not be relevant to you, it may well strike a note with outhers allowing them to also consider points they may have not considered. There was nothing mean or hateful or disrespectful in my reply, just a viewpoint you disagree with.

I realize you have strong feeling toward the subject as you stated. Many non-smokers do. I am also a non-smoker.  We have two different opinions- I'm shocked. I am sure you did notice my summation:" I am also employing a large amount of sarcasm in this response but there are nuggets of truth contained in them. The best thing someone could tell a smoker is they love them and hope they are around when they are older"

Great post.  My grandfather died of emphysema before I was old enough to remember him. Everyone just tells me how much I would have loved him and how much he had loved me. Well, that's fine and freaking dandy, but he's not here for me to meet him, is he? I'm bitter about his death, because now my father smokes the same way, and is coming up on the age at which my grandfather died. While my father saw the death of his father through smoking...he still hasn't stopped. My grandfather smoked until the day he died, even with the oxygen wrapped around his nose.

@ProvokingThought@xanga - They completely changed the title.  And added the questions at the end and the picture at the top. 

Thank you for your kind comment :)

@ProvokingThought@xanga - I know you're familiar with anecdotal evidence; simply saying, "I know a guy who smoked and lived for 90 years" doesn't negate the fact that the vast majority of smokers will have health complications from smoking over the long-term. There are plenty of facts about smoking that could be construed to make it seem healthy: for instance, smokers initially experience an expansion to lung capacity as their bodies struggle to take in more oxygen. In turn, when not smoking, these people inhale more oxygen and so feel a natural high. Does this mean smoking is good for us? Of course not. It's simply a reaction to our bodies attempting to reduce the damage done by even a few cigarettes.

Anecdotal evidence makes for good stories, but are the precise reason for why scientific studies must be based on at least a few participants, and why the most reliable studies involve the most subjects possible to represent a similar segment of the population. In the case of smoking, this would mean observing at least several thousand people. Will some of those people live for a long period of time without complications? Sure -- it's a statistical inevitability. But it's not relevant to the big picture when 90% of the subjects DO develop illnesses, from heart disease to emphysema to sleep apnea, or any other myriad of diseases that can be caused by smoking. Cancer isn't the only, or necessarily worst, thing that can happen, it's just one of the more visible. Sleep apnea, on the other hand, might not be visible to everyone but can be just as dangerous in terms of deadliness. My mother-in-law has apnea, hypertension, diabetes and a number of other health problems; it would be ignorant to assume that her smoking had nothing to do with it, simply because she's still alive and doesn't have cancer.

the odds of someone quitting smoking are slim to none,,, thats why the government is not real concerned about the  the anti smoking nazis,,, tobacco is a big part of their income,,, and the government is by far the biggest trader in tobacco altho they dont manufacture anything with it,,, they save it for a rainy day when theres a bad year,,, and they then sell it to the tobbacco companies at less than cost,,, the cost of tobacco is nothing compared to the tax profits,,,,

some people can quit,,, but most cant...

emphasis should be put on not ever smoking the first one,,, 

@randaness@xanga - "Simply using alcohol is not inherently dangerous"   hahahahaha,,,  stop it,,,, stop it,,, hahahahahahahaha,,,,  name me one person who it can be proven was killed by second hand smoke and ill name a hundred killed by second hand alcohol.... hahahahahahaha,,, just stop it,,,, hahahahahahaha

@PenaltyLife@xanga - do you know what the odds of that happening would be???  i think the story has been stretched at one point,,,  i could be wrong,,, anything i guess is possible,,, but two smokers quitting cold turkey just like that are,,, well,, slim to none,,,,  if they did,, they should have bought lottery tickets on the same day they made that decision...

@xiaosnowtenshi@xanga - listen.  if a police officer is called out for duty and shot in the line of duty, have they not made their family suffer horrible consequences for the greater good of society? i spent two years overseas risking my neck while my family sat here and suffered through CNN reports, holidays without me, and almost 6 months at a time without a phone call.  if you talk about putting your life on the line and your family suffers because of it -- this is a good example in my opinion.

For personal expertise, I have had grandparents on both sides drink themselves to death, two relatives die of lung cancer due to smoking, and lastly, my father, who lived an extremely unhealthy lifestyle and die two months ago because of it.  In the end, all of your deeds ultimately have actions upon the rest of your family.  To sit there on some high horse and accuse others of being selfish because of their lifestyle habits... who the hell are you anyway?  who am i to sit and judge my father, aunts, grandparents etc.. that to me shows the complete lack of respect that is prevalent of the elderly in our society.  i have more respect than that. sorry, but everyone makes mistakes in life which will always consequently affect generations to come after it.. to sit there and try to convince others to put pressure on the ones they love (which the premise of love is to accept somebody for who they are good or bad...) just seems a little bit on the ridiculous side.

@Valerio - One study from Sanford University: Cigarette Secondhand Smoke Outdoors contains levels similar to the indoors
Concentrations of second-hand smoke in cars at dangerous levels -- how many parents smoke with their children in the car, reasoning that "cracking a window" is as good as no exposure?

I realize that most people will not smoke indoors, or immediately around kids. But I also realize that most parents will still smoke around their children, or smoke indoors in a bathroom or separate room with a window cracked, will smoke in a car with the window down -- reasoning that minimal exposure is as good as none at all. But limit such actions even to once a week and you're still talking about dozens of instances of SHS exposure every year for eighteen years or longer, in addition to their increased likelihood to smoke themselves at a young age. This is especially dangerous when one considers that children's lungs are still developing and their immune systems are more fragile, which makes even minimal exposure a health hazard.

Children of smokers more likely to engage in risky behavior
Children of smokers more likely to light up

I'm not saying such parents are ignorant to be mean -- I'm being honest. I truly do not believe that they know the extent of the damage they do to their children by smoking, because I believe most of them do care about their kids. If they were aware of such information they may be more likely to stop smoking. But they either don't bother to do the research because it frightens them, or they write it off as extremist abuse of research. Those who acknowledge the reality of the damage they do to their children and still continue to smoke, though, THOSE are the selfish ones.

Both of my parents have smoked around me my entire life. My mom quit a couple of years ago, but my dad still smokes 2 or 3 packs a day. It's led to my older sister smoking now, one of my sister's having bad asthma, one having mild asthma, & me having difficulty with breathing at times. It does make me feel like he chooses the habit over our health. I just hope my parents don't die early because of it :(

@Valerio -  I'm sorry, but I literally, BEG to differ. Smoking is a danger to both the smoker and anyone the smoker knows. Physically? Not always. Emotionally? Yes. I lost my grandma to COPD, and emphysema, and several other smoking caused ailments. And nothing in my whole life has ever hurt as much as watching her suffer through it, and eventually lose. I hurt over her everyday and everyone else in my family does too. So yes, some people in the world do "worry about smoking" because it is a painful way to lose people you love.

"And then, once we started to learn that smoking was bad for you and started to get after him about it, he did not stop."--assuming it was completely easy to just stop. there are a lot of things we dont just "stop" doing because they arent good for us...and those are things we arent even ADDICTED to (think fast food, not exercising, drinkign too much soda, etc)! you cant even imagine how addictive cigarettes are. it would blow your mind. it puts your self control to SHAME. consider yourselves lucky that you wont have to spend the rest of your lives trying to kick the "habit" (as most nonsmokers smugly..and mistakenly..refer to smoking)